Silly Euro's

[[FF5]Knix]

What GDI said is what we are talking about.

 

While we do not all start at the same start line in this country, anyone with the ability, determination, and gumption to work hard can obtain success. In Europe (at least Holland from what Surak tells me) you can't even work until you are 15!!!1111!!!. I too worked when I was a wee tyke. Caddying, Paper route, raking leaves/shoveling snow, etc.

 

In Europe there are soo many )(*&)(&*!! Unions, you can't get any civil servant to work an inch more then they have too. Everybody expects there 35 days of vacation, and 35 hour work weeks. You look at a french bus driver the wrong way, and they call a national strike shutting down all of Paris. Italy same thing. You can have a lazy sack of bannanas, but you can't fire he/she without jumping through 1000 hoops.

 

My mother told me of my Grandfather back in Italy post WW2. He owned a clothing factory. When things got bad and he had to slowly let people go, HE STILL HAD TO PAY THEM THE SAME SALARY UNTIL THEY WERE ABLE TO FIND ANOTHER JOB!!!!

 

So please don't tell me of how my country is rotting from the core, or is being hedgemonious, etc. Individually we are no better or worse then anyone else. As a whole, our system of government and capitalistic process' blows anyone else's outta the perverbial water.

 

 

 

[Surak]

Knix' date='Dec 14 2005, 07:48 PM' post='20281']

While we do not all start at the same start line in this country, anyone with the ability, determination, and gumption to work hard can obtain success. In Europe (at least Holland from what Surak tells me) you can't even work until you are 15!!!1111!!!. I too worked when I was a wee tyke. Caddying, Paper route, raking leaves/shoveling snow, etc.

 

You can work for money before you're 15 doing peoples gardens, washing their cars, ect. But you can't get an "official" job before you are 15 (for example bringing around papers) and even then you have several restrictions. And that's all the make sure your work doesn't get in the way of your study.

[Alexa]

Jup Indie, that is quite impressive. I'm not from a rich family either but I didn't have to work too hard to finance my studies. Learned a lot at the jobs I had, good thing in a way.

 

Knix' date='Dec 14 2005, 07:48 PM' post='20281']

What GDI said is what we are talking about.

 

While we do not all start at the same start line in this country, anyone with the ability, determination, and gumption to work hard can obtain success. In Europe (at least Holland from what Surak tells me) you can't even work until you are 15!!!1111!!!. I too worked when I was a wee tyke. Caddying, Paper route, raking leaves/shoveling snow, etc.

Here it's the same that Surak said, with same reasons: no extreme child labour to prevent abuse. But paperboygirl is popular too. Just no fulltime jobs.

 

In Europe there are soo many )(*&)(&*!! Unions, you can't get any civil servant to work an inch more then they have too. Everybody expects there 35 days of vacation, and 35 hour work weeks. You look at a french bus driver the wrong way, and they call a national strike shutting down all of Paris. Italy same thing. You can have a lazy sack of bannanas, but you can't fire he/she without jumping through 1000 hoops.

Unions got workers where they are now. Look in the past and decide if you wanted to work like that. It weren't the employers that got social. When too many workers died (among them lots of childern <12 years working in coal mines) the workers rioted and founded the unions.

 

By the way, except for labour work there is no 35 h week in Germany. As a university graduate I am prepared to work between 50-60 h weeks. This is quite normal, and I don't feel that leaves you much time for life. And 25 days of vacation is standard, 30 is what most companys are giving. Perhaps in France it's more like you describe it, Knix. And I doubt that >8 hours at work means >8 h work.

 

My mother told me of my Grandfather back in Italy post WW2. He owned a clothing factory. When things got bad and he had to slowly let people go, HE STILL HAD TO PAY THEM THE SAME SALARY UNTIL THEY WERE ABLE TO FIND ANOTHER JOB!!!!

 

So please don't tell me of how my country is rotting from the core, or is being hedgemonious, etc. Individually we are no better or worse then anyone else. As a whole, our system of government and capitalistic process' blows anyone else's outta the perverbial water.

Here the wages are so high because a big part is going to the unemployment ensurance. In case you are fired the ensurance is paying money. Don't know how this has been in the middle of last century, but never heared of this.

 

I think this is just a matter of view. You sound like you think: I am the employer. I create jobs and pay them => they should be happy to have the job. If don't need them any more, I fire them. They got to look for another job, and they can get one.

 

I think our approach is: You got the opportunity to have your own company. You were educated in this country and are using its benefits (streets, doctors, police, people etc.). You got so far that people work for you. Most of all you are making MONEY from this, and prolly not just little. They make sure your own salary is payed, plus something on top. So you got responsibilities for the people working for you. They are NOT a mere cost-factor.

 

The question is where do you draw the line? How bad may working conditions be? Arbitrary? I don't claim they are bad in the US, but I personally feel better when there are clear laws. This prevents e.g. unfair treatment of a few. The bureaucracy that comes with this is always a downside.

[Eliteone]

I'm going to kinda hijack this thread though it is related to some of the content of peoples posts.

 

I came to the USA almost now 7 years ago with virutually nothing I finished college here and have worked hard to get where I am now (Oh man running servers OYI !! my punishement lol ) *kidding on the ( ) comment.

 

The USA didn't tell me you weren't born here so tough luck. Instead I was given the opportunities (though I had to pursue them on my own obviously)

 

I was raised as a Buddist but am learning about Christianity now. The issue of "eye for a eye" has been a debatable subject for along time. The commandments state thou shall not kill etc.

 

So the act of murder was committed. that is fact.

 

However in the US there is the seperatation of church and state so in society here one cannot legally claim the religous angle.

The crime occurred in the State of California at a time when the law states that one possible sentence for murder is the death penalty. There was a trial and a conviction by a judge and a jury.

 

There has been 20 plus years of legal proceedings, appeals etc.

 

I can see both sides of the discussions here. Those who live in the US and are aware of all the proceedings in this particular case.

In this case how many deaths do you suppose the Crips gang have caused?

On that same thought should a founder of the crips hold some responsibility for the actions of that which they helped create?

 

I know in alot of countries around the world the sentences for what many in the US would consider "light" crime (like theft) can get your limbs cut off among other things.

 

In reading this thread about this particular matter. How about the 4 people who died so long ago now, their lives cut short. What would have became of their lives had they not become victims.

 

I know in the state where I live in the US now I've researched it costs the taxpayers $40000 plus per person currently in prison. Now I'm not trying to put a price on life but when I see the person in prison living with a warm place to sleep plenty of food to eat, recreational opportunites all provided by taxpayers. Then you see the mother and children who are homeless and trying to find a place to stay warm for the night and feed her children................... their only "crime" being down on their luck. I think that $40000 could buy alot of blankets and food for alot of people who despite being poor don't turn to crime against others.

 

 

Just wanted to put my perspective on this.

 

*steps off soapbox*

[[FF5]Knix]

There is actually a possible strike threatened by the New York MTA (Metropolitan Transit Authority) scheduled for 12:00Am tomorrow morning. Although we have a law in this state which makes it illegal for public servants to strike, they are still threatening to do so. This would shut down all public busses and Subways through the 5 boroughs that make up New York city (Manhattan, Queens, Brooklyn, The Bronx, and Staten Island). The State is threatening fines against the MTA and its members of Millions of $$ each day they are on strike. Should be an interesting day tomorrow.

 

 

[ONYX]

In Britain, it feels like we have two mates (USA & Europe) always arguing, we have to keep getting in the middle of them both trying to smooth the troubles over, and stop them coming to blows.

The only trouble is these mates are like two 7ft (>2m) BIG GUYS and we are only little, peace making is hard work.........spare a thought for little britain and back off each other for a while

[[FF5]Knix]

YOU MUST CHOOSE ONYX!!!!!

 

Who speaks your language?

Who helped you during WW2?

Who watches your friggen comedies on the BBC?

Who is in love with your Royal Family?

 

CHOOSE!

 

 

 

[[TNT] Sonic Goo]

*sparing a thought for little Britain*

[ONYX]

Sonic Goo' date='Dec 16 2005, 07:30 PM' post='20404']

*sparing a thought for little Britain*

 

 

Heh heh........ I had that in mind too after writing, but I thought no-one else would know what the hell I was talking about..............another wacko comedy Knix will have to endure

 

If you put all the right wingers from USA and all the left wingers from Europe, in a cooking pot, heat it up and give it a good 'ole stir, you know what you would get.............a bit o peace and quiet "

[Lodingi]

Heh heh........ I had that in mind too after writing, but I thought no-one else would know what the hell I was talking about..............another wacko comedy Knix will have to endure

 

If you put all the right wingers from USA and all the left wingers from Europe, in a cooking pot, heat it up and give it a good 'ole stir, you know what you would get.............a bit o peace and quiet "

 

 

 

i think i speak for everyone when i say............HUH???

[ONYX]

i think i speak for everyone when i say............HUH???

 

Perhaps, at this festive time of year, everyone could sing it......Soprano's to the left....Alto's to the right.....baratones in the middle.....ready...on the count of three

1 - 2 - 3

HUH

 

(ps. what bit didn't you understand?)

[Lodingi]

Perhaps, at this festive time of year, everyone could sing it......Soprano's to the left....Alto's to the right.....baratones in the middle.....ready...on the count of three

1 - 2 - 3

HUH

 

(ps. what bit didn't you understand?)

 

 

oh so now you bring the mafia into this thread? wtf!

 

[[FF5]Knix]

Arnold's response...

 

(This is a prime example on why I am a Republican)

 

http://www.breitbart.com/news/2005/12/19/D8EJKF48B.html

 

[ONYX]

I would not want Arnie's job for anything...........damned if you..........damned if you don't........sheesh

 

make you appreciate your own job

[{GD}Independent]

Knix' date='Dec 19 2005, 09:04 PM' post='20473']

Arnold's response...

 

(This is a prime example on why I am a Republican)

 

http://www.breitbart.com/news/2005/12/19/D8EJKF48B.html

 

 

Awesome! What a hoot!

[RXS]

Atta boy Arnie!

*tips his hat and wonders if Arnie has a snowballs chance in hell of becoming US President*

[Spacko]

And of course the spin in the media over here on his reaction was 'Arnie gets grumpy and distances himself from home town concerned for the man who denied killing four people until the end'. Ugh.

[ONYX]

I guess there are a lot more Liberal views in Europe than the States, but I wonder if there is also an element of fear, the USA is the only super power and can dominate if she wants to.

What I think that most Europeans do not realize (probably because of the langauge thing) that there are a lot of ordinary people in America that are decent, honest and regular and who ever is president of the day.....will always be accountable to them.............so we are all in good hands

[[FF5]Knix]

I guess there are a lot more Liberal views in Europe than the States, but I wonder if there is also an element of fear, the USA is the only super power and can dominate if she wants to.

What I think that most Europeans do not realize (probably because of the langauge thing) that there are a lot of ordinary people in America that are decent, honest and regular and who ever is president of the day.....will always be accountable to them.............so we are all in good hands

 

 

We ain't the ones u should be worried about m8.

 

(see China, N. Korea, and most of the countries in the middle east )

[Phantizen]

FOLLOW UP: Looks like they made good on their threats.

 

GRAZ, Austria - "I'll be back." That pledge from the Terminator traditionally has had special meaning in

Arnold Schwarzenegger's hometown.

 

But the romance is now over between Schwarzenegger and Graz, Austria's second-largest city, after the California governor refused to spare the lives of three convicted murderers and shows no signs of preventing another execution scheduled for next month.

 

Acting on Schwarzenegger's orders two weeks after the Dec. 13 execution of former Crips gang leader Stanley Tookie Williams, city leaders Tuesday deleted all references to the bodybuilder-turned-governor on Web sites linked to Graz. Over the weekend, they also stripped his name from the city's soccer stadium.

[{GD}Independent]

FOLLOW UP: Looks like they made good on their threats.

 

GRAZ, Austria - "I'll be back." That pledge from the Terminator traditionally has had special meaning in

Arnold Schwarzenegger's hometown.

 

But the romance is now over between Schwarzenegger and Graz, Austria's second-largest city...

 

4 generations ago, my family lived in Graz. Before that, it was Eggenberg, Austria (we're the "Eggenbergers" now!). There's a brewery there that's been in operation since the 1400s. You guessed it! The Eggenberg Brewery, makers of Eggenberger beer! (one of our brands is the strongest beer sold on earth, by alcohol content. It's NASTY! but the lager and pilsner are 2 of the best beers i've ever tasted, and i've tasted a LOT of beer!

 

end sidebar!

[DeathValleyGirl]

Mail me some bier bitte!!

 

DANKE!

[{GD}Independent]

lol! It's hard to get here in the States. My wife gets me a case at Christmas, but it runs over $60. A treat i don't plan to share, sorry!